"I Hope He Knows He's Found": The Gacy Identification Project and the Andy Drath Case, 2015

Name: "I Hope He Knows He's Found": The Gacy Identification Project and the Andy Drath Case, 2015
Uploaded: 2015-09-25T00:00:00Z
Duration: 17 min
Description: The Cook County Sheriff's Office's own video of its September 23, 2015 news conference: DNA given to the Gacy victim identification project solved a different case, identifying Chicago teenager Andy Drath as a 1979 San Francisco homicide victim. Sheriff Tom Dart and Drath's sister, Dr. Willa Wertheimer, speak.

The Cook County Sheriff's Office's own video of its September 23, 2015 news conference: DNA given to the Gacy victim identification project solved a different case, identifying Chicago teenager Andy Drath as a 1979 San Francisco homicide victim. Sheriff Tom Dart and Drath's sister, Dr. Willa Wertheimer, speak.

Subject: John Wayne Gacy
Recorded: September 23, 2015
Runtime: 17:00

Content warning: Refers to a teenager shot to death and buried, and to Gacy's murders of young men. No graphic detail.

The Interview

This is not an interview, and John Wayne Gacy does not appear or speak in it. It is the Cook County Sheriff's Office's own recording of a news conference held on September 23, 2015. Sheriff Tom Dart explains how a case unrelated to Gacy was solved through the office's Gacy victim identification project, and Dr. Willa Wertheimer reads a statement about her brother, Andre "Andy" Drath, before both answer reporters' questions.

Historical Context

Gacy was arrested in December 1978 after the remains of young men were found in the crawl space of his home in Norwood Park Township, near Chicago. He was convicted of 33 murders and executed on May 10, 1994. Eight of his victims could not be identified. In 2011 Sheriff Dart reopened the investigation into them, exhumed remains and asked families of young men who went missing in the 1970s to give DNA. One victim, William George Bundy, was identified that year; seven remained unidentified when this news conference was held.

Circumstances

Andy Drath, a ward of the Illinois Department of Children and Family Services, was 16 when he was last seen in Chicago in late 1978 or early 1979; he had gone to San Francisco hoping to have his guardianship transferred to California. In June 1979 a young man's body, shot and buried in sand, was found on Ocean Beach in San Francisco and recorded as John Doe No. 89. Wertheimer gave DNA after the 2011 appeal, thinking her brother might have been a Gacy victim. It did not match any Gacy victim. In late 2014 the San Francisco Medical Examiner's Office uploaded DNA from the John Doe to CODIS; a genetic association with Wertheimer was reported in May 2015 and supported by an "Andy" tattoo and dental records, while DCFS records documented his travel to San Francisco; Wertheimer was told on September 10, 2015 that he had been officially identified.

What the Recording Covers

Dart describes the purpose of the 2011 reopening, says that people who came forward with DNA have helped close cases that had nothing to do with Gacy, and recounts how Drath's DNA profile was found. He stresses that Drath "was not a victim of" Gacy and that San Francisco was still investigating who killed him. Wertheimer remembers fishing, frog hunting and Beggars' Night with her brother, says that "the knowing is so much better," and thanks the San Francisco police who kept the evidence. In answer to questions, Dart talks about the seven Gacy victims still unidentified, the kind of young men Gacy targeted, the child welfare system of the 1970s, the 53 or 54 DNA samples received, and what he calls the "atrocious" handling of missing persons cases. He says that the project found that Gacy "had traveled extensively through the United States" in ways not known before; that is his statement and is not verified here.

What Makes the Recording Significant

It records the head of the Gacy identification project describing, in his own words, the project's method, its limits and an unexpected result: families who suspected a Gacy connection getting answers about entirely different deaths. Drath's case is one of the unrelated cold cases the project resolved.

Archival Importance

It is a primary government recording, not a news edit.

Important Caveats

Gacy does not speak in this video, and Andy Drath was not one of his victims; the page must say so plainly. Dart's figure of "12 other cases" closed matches the office's release of the same day, which says 12 cases have been closed through Gacy leads; the release also counts 11 unrelated missing-person cases and four unrelated cold cases resolved, so the totals are not fully consistent. His remarks on Gacy's travels are his claim. The sheriff mentions a Utah case solved through a family in Washington, Illinois; its name is not clear in the machine sources. Reporters' questions are off-microphone and partly unclear. No arrest in Drath's killing was announced.

Sheriff Tom Dart: Is everyone all set? [unclear: "Is everyone all set?" (second machine pass) / "is everyone else in" (captions)] Thanks, everybody, for coming here today. Um, we have talked to you, uh, before about, um, some of the different investigations we've been involved with in regards to things that came out of the, uh, Gacy reopening. And as many of you know, when we reopened that case, it was to try to identify the eight unidentified individuals that were found, um, in the crawl space there. We have found one [unclear: "today" (both sources; the sense may be "to date")], but in the course of doing that, we've closed out 12 other cases as well. And that has come about exclusively because people have come forward after the announcement that we were going to work on this to submit DNA to be put into the database, so that we could try to make some, um, type of dent in all the missing persons that are out there: unidentified individuals who have been killed, unidentified people who have died in the course of years.

Sheriff Tom Dart: Um, today we're announcing that we have been able to close out another case as a result of that similar pattern, where someone has come forward to have their DNA submitted with the thought that maybe their loved one had been a victim of John Wayne Gacy, but it turns out, um, that he was not a victim of him, um, but had died nonetheless in another part of the country. Um, the victim we're talking about today is Andy Drath. Andy was a young man who lived in the north side of the city of Chicago. Uh, he had a, uh, till the age of 16, he lived in the area. He was a young man who, his sister is here today, who was the one who was instrumental in making this match, and she's going to talk about him. He lived with her for a while after a period of time. His mother passed away when he was young. Uh, his stepfather, after a while, had him, um, he was made a ward of the state, and as a ward of the state, um, he went back and forth in the state before he wanted to have his custody transferred out to San Francisco. And that was the last he was heard from. This was 1978, 1979.

Sheriff Tom Dart: Uh, both his sister and another individual contacted us shortly after we made the announcement about the Gacy case, that we were looking for people to come forward. Uh, Willa, his sister, uh, supplied us with DNA shortly after we made the announcement back in 2011, I think it was. And we went about investigating it. Andy fit the age of many of the victims of John Gacy. He fit the general region where John Gacy was getting victims from. And Andy went missing during that period of time toward the end when John Gacy was killing a lot of people. So a lot of that fit the mold. We got the DNA from Willa. We put it into the system, the lab down in Texas, which has done amazing work with us throughout this, um, uh, investigation. They did the analysis, compared it to the remains from the crawl space, and there was no connection. There was no connection whatsoever.

Sheriff Tom Dart: We then had the DNA put into the CODIS system nonetheless, in the event that, like some of the other cases, there might be a different connection. Uh, after a period of time, uh, the medical examiner's office in, uh, San Francisco put in a tissue sample of an individual who had been shot to death in San Francisco back in '79. They put the tissue sample in to, uh, be analyzed. It was analyzed in 2014. Uh, the DNA from that tissue sample was put into CODIS in 2014, and shortly, not too long ago, a couple months ago, that the hit occurred between Willa's DNA that she had provided and the individual, uh, from San Francisco.

Sheriff Tom Dart: That individual had been shot to death and had been left buried in San Francisco back in '79. We did the work based on the, uh, the very good work that was done by the San Francisco authorities back in '79 that showed that they had documented that the individual who had been found had a tattoo actually on his arm that said "Andy" on it. We had that, but with the DNA, we had the match. And so that case, which had been unsolved since 1979, is now officially closed. San Francisco is working on it as we speak, um, in trying to close out who was responsible for the death. There is no information on that right now, because at that point they didn't even know who that was.

Sheriff Tom Dart: Uh, so this is yet another one of the examples that we plead with people that if you have any missing loved one, please, please, please take advantage of the DNA technology that's out there now. Give the DNA to us or another local law enforcement agency to have put into the CODIS system, and you too might be able to have these questions answered. That's how this, uh, case has been closed out. It's how many of the other ones have been closed out. The initial spark was thinking that just maybe there was a connection with John Gacy. There wasn't, but nonetheless it ended up in bringing some closure to a family that has long sought this closure. So I was going to have Willa come forward. Uh, Willa was Andy's sister. Uh, [unclear: "Willa, do you want to go?" (Whisper) / "what would you want" (captions)]

Willa Wertheimer: Thank you.

Sheriff Tom Dart: [unclear: "Oh, you're welcome." (captions only)]

Willa Wertheimer: Hi. My brother Andy and I [unclear: "My brother Andy and I" / "My brother and Andy and I" (Whisper)], we, we loved fishing. Then we'd tromp through the shore of a small lake catching frogs and turtles. He climbed everything, and I don't think there was one pair of pants that boy didn't rip. The coolest thing was when he taught me to whistle with my fingers like the boys did. He didn't even need his fingers. He just curled his tongue, and I never could develop that level of mastery. We fought like siblings, but we always had our bond. Even after he left home, he'd call me or visit every month or two. Then when I was 13 or 14, that stopped.

Willa Wertheimer: In 2011, Sheriff Dart reopened the John Wayne Gacy case, as there were still unidentified victims. And that seemed like a long shot, looking for a kid living on the fringe after 35 years. My brother had been missing since the late '70s, a runaway, and he had become an invisible life living on the streets. And since he would have been a typical target for Gacy, I came to see Detective Moran and submitted my DNA. Although my DNA did not match the Gacy victims, I got a call recently that there was a John Doe found murdered in San Francisco from back in '79.

Willa Wertheimer: So 36 years ago, the police diligently cared for this boy's remains, this young man, who may have been regarded by some as a nobody or just a street kid. And because of that professionalism, there was a good amount of evidence that was stored. We missed out on so much. My sons will never know their Uncle Andy. I never got to know him as a man. I would have liked to have just had the ordinary, just, life's ups and, ups and downs, and Thanksgiving dinner. I'd like to think we'd have had each other's back in this world, and been those two and just pals through it all.

Willa Wertheimer: I have two main messages. One, to those whose loved ones have gone missing, even long ago: I stand here as a testament that, that you'd never lose hope for closure that you've longed for. Believe me, although I'm terribly sad, the knowing is so much better. No matter how invisible you think your relative may be, there's likely a good amount of information that can be found. If you think he may have been a Gacy victim or just long missing, please call Sheriff Dart and submit your DNA to the National Missing Persons Database.

Willa Wertheimer: Two, there's been a lot of talk about which lives matter. These blue lives care for these invisible lives. They're not forgotten. Because of that, John Doe No. 89 was treated with dignity, and now will come home to his kid sister with his name, Andy. Thanks.

Sheriff Tom Dart: Any questions from anybody? [the last two words from the second machine pass]

Reporter: Uh, Willa, talk to us about getting that phone call, and now what, four years after you gave your DNA, you got that phone call from the sheriff or from [unclear: "Justin Mason" (Whisper) / "Justice and Jason" (captions); probably Jason (Detective Jason Moran)].

Willa Wertheimer: It was odd beginning to hope for a positive identification, because it's not that I hoped he was dead [unclear: "dead" (Whisper and second machine pass) / "instead" (captions)]. I just had so many other things going through my mind of what he could be going through or what could have happened to him. It's certainty that he's not suffering anymore, you know, that he can't be hurt anymore.

Reporter: Is he, uh, when you talk about your Uncle Andy to your kids, talk to us about what kind of a mythological [unclear: "theory" (both sources; the sense may be "figure")] he has been, and what this does to that story.

Willa Wertheimer: Big brother. I told him about, we'd get up to all kinds of wonderful kid stuff, um, going out trick-or-treating the night before Halloween because we were told that's Beggars' Night, you know, just all kinds of fun things that we'd do. Um, his sense of mischief and his desire to be, um, the funny one, or his desire to be endearing. He would do just about anything if you dared him. But he was a kid, you know.

Reporter: What's it been like going three decades now without knowing? [captions; Whisper has "like going three decades now without going"]

Willa Wertheimer: Just a huge unfinished line, just waiting to exhale, or worrying about what could have happened to him, or [unclear: "his mind" (both sources; the sense may be "in my mind")] that he wouldn't have called me, 'cause he always did. You know, I worried what could have happened to him too [unclear: "I worried" (captions) / "A word" (Whisper)]. You know, and the imaginings were worse. And it's so good to know he's at peace. He's coming home. And I don't know if people can feel or know anything after they die, but I hope he knows he's found.

Reporter: Sheriff, I actually, I apologize, I actually have a question for you.

Sheriff Tom Dart: Sure.

Reporter: Uh, so there are still seven unidentified Gacy victims, right?

Sheriff Tom Dart: Yes.

Reporter: So what are your hopes, uh, since you've gone through a lot of the DNA already, what are your hopes that they'll be identified?

Sheriff Tom Dart: When we began this endeavor, we were, uh, hopeful but not naive. We did not, in our wildest dreams, think that we were going to have a, um, quick resolution to the eight. We never really felt that we were going to get complete resolution. Uh, a lot of it has to do with the nature of the case. We did a lot of work on the front end studying the case and re-examining it. Went through the evidence rooms, went through stuff no one had looked at before. And in the course of that, we found Gacy had traveled extensively through the United States that no one had really known as much about before. So the breadth of where his victims could come from all of a sudden started expanding, which by its nature then meant that we were probably going to have less and less of a chance to bring closure to the eight.

Sheriff Tom Dart: And, uh, the nature of how Gacy went after people: he went after young men who were on the fringes of society, by and large. And so a lot of them were people who had some connection one time or another with our child welfare system, which has its issues now. Can you imagine what it was like back in the '70s as far as tracking anything, keeping track of people that were bouncing from one placement to another and evaporating into the ether? And so I'm not trying to say that, um, we aren't hopeful [unclear: "aren't" (captions) / "are" (Whisper)]. We are hopeful we'll close out some more cases. And the only way it will will be following what Willa was talking about: people coming forward, even if they aren't thinking that there's a connection there. But that will be the break, because that's what we have found, it breaks these cases.

Sheriff Tom Dart: But the very nature of this was always going to be a bit of a long shot, given the people that he targeted and the breadth of his killing and the like. So we're, we're hopeful, but in the same sense, we actually have a general understanding of the type of victims we're looking for, and they're, by very nature, are very, very difficult ones. But I'll tell you what, a, a sister, a stepsister, you know, all those different types of relations, a cousin, people like that who might just remember vaguely that one cousin that they, that vanished in the '70s, that would be help to us, a huge help.

Sheriff Tom Dart: And so it's, it's frankly through coverage of all the different times we close out other cases that it's almost like clockwork. After that occurs, the next few days, Jason's phone starts ringing off the hook again. And that's all good. That's what we want. We want more and more of that to come in, because it's, it really is. These, um, the ones, the seven we got left, I guarantee each one of those, if we close them out, they're all going to, we're all going to sit there and think, "What a long shot that one was." But it was someone who took that sort of leap and said, "What's the harm? It takes seconds to have DNA swabbed. What is the harm?"

Reporter: So you're still taking in DNA from anyone who...

Sheriff Tom Dart: Yes, we are. We're still doing it. Jason, actively, is still investigating numerous leads that come in. We do the same type of siphoning process. When they come in, we first see if they fit the profile of a Gacy victim, and if it happened during that time frame and all that, and then we go on to the next step. But even if it doesn't fit that profile, we still work on those cases to try to bring closure. Because one of the things that we found out, unfortunately, in the course of this, is that the way missing persons were handled, even, frankly, up until recently, is, is atrocious.

Sheriff Tom Dart: You want to talk about people that no one in the system cared about. And that's why when Willa was commenting particularly about the, the thoughtfulness and professionalism of the way Andy's body was treated in San Francisco: that is not what the norm has been. Uh, missing persons, unidentified people aren't given the dignity they should. We had found that out. And the, uh, it's, it's really mind-numbing to us, at this day and age, that missing persons are still in this world that people don't care too much about.

Reporter: How many samples have you gotten, estimated?

Sheriff Tom Dart: [unclear: "God, how many?" (captions only)] It's 53, 54 [this first figure may be another person's answer, off-microphone (speaker uncertain)]. Yeah, in the 50s. 53, 54 as far as DNA samples.

Reporter: And were you expecting this when you started this in [unclear: "2011" (Whisper) / "in 0..." (captions)], [unclear: "were you expecting to close out cases" (captions, partial: "were exp to close out cases")]?

Sheriff Tom Dart: No. To be honest with you, we weren't. I mean, we sort of thought that there might be a couple cases here or there, I guess, but it was really far off on that. We, we honestly were focused almost exclusively on, on the Gacy, uh, victims and hadn't thought about [unclear: "this" (Whisper) / "all us" (captions)]. And then, frankly, as these cases have been coming forward, um, each one of them has presented a scenario where you couldn't imagine that this would be closed out via this. But it's, it's occurred. I mean, whether it's, you know, the [unclear: "snowy boy" (Whisper) / "Noy boy" (captions)] that we found on, he was found on the side of a mountain in Utah. I mean, who could have ever thought that would have been closed out based on a DNA sample given from a family in Washington, Illinois, that came forward? And, my God.

Sheriff Tom Dart: Anybody else?

Reporter: Uh, Willa, just very quickly, um, obviously your brother died under terrible circumstances as well. Does it, tell us what your thoughts about that, and the fact that actually he wasn't a Gacy victim. Are you relieved at all that he wasn't a Gacy victim?

Willa Wertheimer: There's really no measuring stick of when violation is violation, or when tragedy is tragedy, or someone's only a little bit hurt in this way or that way. Um, I guess the quick answer, oh golly, I'm not sure what the answer to that is. I, it's not, somebody killed him. Somebody hurt him grievously. And, um, I hope that one, or whoever it is, is brought to justice.

Reporter: When was the last time you saw your brother? [captions and second machine pass; not in the first Whisper pass]

Willa Wertheimer: I was about 13 or 14.

Unidentified: [unclear: "13 or 14?" (second machine pass only)]

Willa Wertheimer: I didn't memorize exactly when it was, 'cause I did not know that it was going to be the last time I'd see him.

Sheriff Tom Dart: Thank you, everybody. Thank you.

Unidentified: Thank you.

Reporter: [unclear: "I just have a pronounce" (Whisper) / "You have a pronounce" (captions) / "You know, pronounce" (second machine pass)] on your last name?

Willa Wertheimer: Wertheimer.

Reporter: Wertheimer.

Willa Wertheimer: Mm-hmm. [About 16:55 to 17:00: no further words picked up; the captions end with "sh" and the second machine pass with "We're fine," neither attributable. The video ends.] ---