"I Was Doing the Will of God": Joseph Paul Franklin Speaks to CNN Before His Execution, 2013

Name: "I Was Doing the Will of God": Joseph Paul Franklin Speaks to CNN Before His Execution, 2013
Uploaded: 2013-11-19
Duration: 2 min 34 s
Description: A week before his execution, white supremacist serial killer Joseph Paul Franklin told CNN's Kyung Lah he had shot to start a "race war", had thought he was doing God's will, and now believed violence was wrong.

A week before his execution, white supremacist serial killer Joseph Paul Franklin told CNN's Kyung Lah he had shot to start a "race war", had thought he was doing God's will, and now believed violence was wrong.

Subject: Joseph Paul Franklin
Recorded: about November 20, 2013
Runtime: 2:34

Content warning: Concerns racially motivated murders, including the shooting of two boys aged 13 and 14, and contains racist language.

The Interview

In November 2013, about a week before he was due to be executed in Missouri, Joseph Paul Franklin was interviewed on death row by CNN correspondent Kyung Lah. Asked how many people he had murdered, he said he would rather not say, and agreed that Lah's count of 22 was "approximately it". He said he had shot people to try to start a "race war", that he had once believed he was "doing the will of God", and that he now saw that "violence is wrong at any time".

Historical Context

Franklin, born James Clayton Vaughn Jr. in Mobile, Alabama, on April 13, 1950, travelled the United States between 1977 and 1980 shooting Black people, interracial couples and Jewish people in an attempt to start a race war. He was convicted of eight murders in five states. On March 6, 1978, he shot the publisher Larry Flynt in Lawrenceville, Georgia, leaving him paralysed; no one was ever charged with that shooting. His death sentence was for the murder of Gerald Gordon, 42, shot on October 8, 1977, outside a synagogue in suburban St. Louis.

Circumstances of the Interview

CNN published a report on the interview on November 18, 2013, two days before the execution, and uploaded this clip the next day. Franklin gave several interviews in his final week, including one to the St. Louis Post-Dispatch, in which he said he had renounced his racist views. He was executed by lethal injection at Bonne Terre, Missouri, on November 20, 2013.

What the Interview Covers

Lah asks about the number of his victims and about "those two boys in Cincinnati", aged 13 and 14. Franklin says he does not really think about them, then that he regrets shooting them. He describes waiting by a railroad track for "the first either interracial couple or black to walk by", says he hoped other white supremacists would follow his example, and says that hate groups tell him he is a hero. He says it took him many years to change, that he had thought the whole system was "evil" and "corrupt", that he believes he deserves whatever happens to him on November 20, and that he has his "trust in God".

What Makes the Recording Significant

The clip records Franklin, days before his death, stating his motive in his own words and disowning it. It sets his account of a religious and racial "mission" beside his stated renunciation of violence, which is consistent with what he told other reporters that week.

Archival Importance

The FBI says Franklin killed at least 15 people and possibly more than 20. This short interview, published by CNN itself, is one of several recordings made in his final week, and preserves his own account of his motive.

Important Caveats

Lah's figure of 22 is her count; Franklin was convicted of eight murders, and estimates of his victims vary. His remorse and renunciation of racism are his own statements, made shortly before execution. The clip is an edited excerpt of a longer interview. The two Cincinnati victims are not named in the clip.

Kyung Lah: Do you know how many people you murdered?

Joseph Paul Franklin: Yeah, but I'd rather not mention it.

Kyung Lah: By my count, it's 22 people. Is that the same number that you have?

Joseph Paul Franklin: That's approximately it. I wish I could go back and change things, but there's no way I can do it, so I'll try to make the best of it. If I had some way to make amends to them, I would try to do that. Being locked up in here on death row, with an execution date a week away, I can't really do a whole lot for them.

Kyung Lah: Do you think about those two boys in Cincinnati?

Joseph Paul Franklin: No, I don't really think about them. I can't go back and think about the cases individually. I have too much other problems, too much other things I have to focus on and worry about.

Kyung Lah: Those are two young boys, just 13 and 14 years old.

Joseph Paul Franklin: I regret the fact that I shot them now.

Kyung Lah: Why did you shoot them?

Joseph Paul Franklin: Well, I was just sitting on that railroad track, waiting for the first either interracial couple or black to walk by.

Kyung Lah: And what was your mission?

Joseph Paul Franklin: Well, to try to get a race war started, [unclear: "a mixed race couples and blacks"]. I figured once I started doing it and showed them how, other white supremacists would do the same thing, follow suit.

Kyung Lah: So you hope people would copy you?

Joseph Paul Franklin: I hope that other white nationalists would do the same thing.

Kyung Lah: Do you think you're a hero to those hate groups?

Joseph Paul Franklin: Well, that's what they tell me, you know. I just felt like I was at war, you know, and it was, the survival of the white race was at stake, stuff like that, you know.

Kyung Lah: Do you feel that way now?

Joseph Paul Franklin: No, not at all. No, I can see now I was wrong. It's wrong. Violence is wrong at any time, you know.

Kyung Lah: Do you feel that way because you got caught?

Joseph Paul Franklin: No, not at all. As a matter of fact, it took me many, many years to change. I actually thought, as misguided as I was, I was doing the will of God. You know, I thought I was actually doing right. This is what God wanted me to do.

Kyung Lah: But the police were pursuing you. How could you think that?

Joseph Paul Franklin: Yeah, I know it, but I thought the whole system was all evil, though. You know, the whole system was corrupt.

Kyung Lah: Do you believe you deserve what's going to happen to you on November 20th?

Joseph Paul Franklin: Yeah, I believe I deserve anything that'll happen to me on November 20th, yeah.

Kyung Lah: Are you scared?

Joseph Paul Franklin: I got my trust in God.