Wayne Williams on His Trial Outburst: CNN Prison Interview with Soledad O'Brien, 2010

Name: Wayne Williams on His Trial Outburst: CNN Prison Interview with Soledad O'Brien, 2010
Uploaded: 2010-06-02T00:00:00Z
Duration: 3 min 15 s
Description: In a prison interview for CNN, Wayne Williams called himself his "own worst enemy" at his 1982 trial, explained calling the prosecutor a "drop shot", and again denied killing anyone.

In a prison interview for CNN, Wayne Williams called himself his "own worst enemy" at his 1982 trial, explained calling the prosecutor a "drop shot", and again denied killing anyone.

Subject: Wayne Williams
Recorded: about 2010
Runtime: 3:15

Content warning: Concerns the Atlanta murders of 1979 to 1981, in which many of the victims were children; no graphic detail.

The Interview

In 2010 CNN broadcast "The Atlanta Child Murders", a documentary reported by Soledad O'Brien. For it, O'Brien interviewed Wayne Williams on camera in a Georgia prison; CNN described it as his first television interview in at least a decade. This three-minute excerpt, re-uploaded to YouTube by a third party, centres on his 1982 trial. Williams looks back on his own behaviour on the witness stand, explains why he called the prosecutor a "drop shot", and repeats that he did not kill anyone. His own words take up a little under a minute of the clip; the rest is O'Brien's narration and the recollections of a trial witness, the prosecutor and the stepmother of one of the young victims.

Historical Context

Between 1979 and 1981 a series of children, teenagers and young adults, almost all of them Black, were murdered or went missing in Atlanta. In May 1981 police on a stakeout heard a splash near the James Jackson Parkway bridge over the Chattahoochee River and stopped Williams, then 22, as he drove off the bridge. Days later the body of Nathaniel Cater was found in the river. Williams was arrested in June 1981 and tried for the murders of two adult men, Nathaniel Cater and Jimmy Ray Payne. On February 27, 1982, he was convicted of both and sentenced to two consecutive life terms. Police went on to attribute many of the Atlanta child murders to him, but he was never charged with them, and that attribution has never been tested in court.

Circumstances of the Interview

Williams has maintained his innocence since his arrest. The excerpt concentrates on the trial: the witness Robert Henry, who said he saw Williams with Nathaniel Cater on the night of the bridge incident; Williams's own testimony that he was at home, backed by his parents; and his third day on the stand, when, as the narration describes it, he "blew up" at prosecutor Jack Mallard under cross-examination. CNN put those episodes to Williams nearly thirty years later.

What the Interview Covers

Williams says he was "probably my own worst enemy" on the stand and that he "played right into these people's hands". Asked about calling the prosecutor a "drop shot", he explains the term as meaning someone who is worthless. When O'Brien's narration notes that he had also used it of poor Black children on the streets, he answers that using the words does not make him a murderer, and says, "The fact is, I didn't kill anybody." Patrick Baltazar's stepmother recalls watching him in court and hearing in his manner a challenge to "prove it". After the narration reports the verdict and sentence, Williams says people wanted the case closed and wanted him to be "the Atlanta monster".

What Makes the Recording Significant

The clip sets Williams's own account of his trial beside the testimony and impressions of people who were in the courtroom. In the clip the prosecutor says the jury understood what his outburst under cross-examination meant; here Williams gives his own view of it, decades later.

Archival Importance

CNN described this as Williams's first television interview in at least a decade, and his case remains disputed: the two convictions stand, while the many child murders attributed to him were never tried. This excerpt preserves his own statement of his position in 2010.

Important Caveats

Everything Williams says about his innocence and about why he was convicted is his claim; the jury convicted him of both murders and the convictions stand. The uploader's title, "Atlanta Child Murderer Speaks", overstates the record: he was convicted of the murders of two adult men, not of any child's murder. This is a short, edited excerpt of a longer CNN programme, re-uploaded by a third party; it is not the full interview. The stepmother's account of his manner in court is her impression.

Soledad O'Brien: This witness, Robert Henry, did place Wayne Williams with the very last victim, Nathaniel Cater. Henry worked with Cater. He said he saw him leaving this theater with Williams on the night of the bridge incident. Henry has no doubt, even today, about what he saw.

Robert Henry: [unclear: "You're" / "They're"] holding hands, you know, like male and female. Well, if you're holding hands with one of my co-workers and both of you are males, what am I supposed to do? Turn my head? [unclear: "Up."]

Soledad O'Brien: When Wayne Williams took the stand, he swore he never met Nathaniel Cater. On the evening Henry said he saw them, Wayne testified he was home, sick and asleep in bed. His mother and father, now deceased, backed him up. Homer Williams said he had the white station wagon until almost midnight. Under cross-examination, in his third day on the stand, Wayne Williams blew up at prosecutor Jack Mallard.

Jack Mallard: That morning, he was a complete different person. Immediately he started attacking. He came out of the chute like a bull. When he said, "You want the real Wayne Williams, you've got him," [unclear: "I think" / "and I think"] all of us, the jury, understood that, yeah.

Wayne Williams: I was probably my own worst enemy. I was an arrogant, [unclear: "bus-headed" / "bust-headed" / probably "bull-headed"] idiot at the time, and I played right into these people's hands. I could see almost the shock in the jurors' faces, if they [unclear: "said" / "say"], "My God, is this the same Wayne that was up here yesterday?" I could see that.

Soledad O'Brien: When you got angry with the prosecutor, you said, "You're a drop shot."

Wayne Williams: I called him a drop shot.

Soledad O'Brien: What's a drop shot? What's that mean?

Wayne Williams: Quite simply, in our vernacular, a drop shot is a guy who's not worth much of anything. You know, just drop him and shoot him and get him out of the way. In other words, you're useless.

Soledad O'Brien: We reminded Wayne that he also called poor Black children on the streets the same thing: drop shots.

Wayne Williams: That does not make me a murderer simply because I said somebody is a drop shot, or because I called him a drop shot. That does not make Wayne Williams a murderer because I [unclear: "said" / "say"] somebody is a street urchin. You know, come on, we're talking about murder. The fact is, I didn't kill anybody.

Soledad O'Brien: Patrick Baltazar's stepmother was watching in court that day.

Sheila Baltazar: I'm like, this man got to be crazy. This man. I mean, he, it's like he's saying, you know, "Yeah, I killed him, but you better prove it. You know, can you prove it?" He was doing everything he can to outsmart everybody. And it was like, "I did it, but can you prove I did it?"

Soledad O'Brien: The jury didn't come back until late the second evening. The verdict: guilty on both counts of murder. Wayne Williams was sentenced to serve two life terms.

Wayne Williams: People only wanted to look at the negative side, because they wanted in their heart for this case to be over and for Wayne to be the Atlanta monster. They wanted closure at any cost. [03:08 to 03:15: no speech in either machine source; clip ends.] ---