"Another Three or Four Murders": Clive Small on Ivan Milat, Ten News, 2010

Name: "Another Three or Four Murders": Clive Small on Ivan Milat, Ten News, 2010
Uploaded: 2010-12-20T00:00:00Z
Duration: 2 min 47 s
Description: A December 2010 Ten News report by crime reporter Harry Potter. Retired lead investigator Clive Small says police believed Ivan Milat committed three or four more murders but lacked the evidence to charge him, and that Milat acted alone. Milat is not heard.

A December 2010 Ten News report by crime reporter Harry Potter. Retired lead investigator Clive Small says police believed Ivan Milat committed three or four more murders but lacked the evidence to charge him, and that Milat acted alone. Milat is not heard.

Subject: Ivan Robert Marko Milat
Recorded: about December 20, 2010
Runtime: 2:47

Content warning: Refers to the murders of seven backpackers, a mass shooting in which a pregnant woman was killed, the stabbing of a family, kidnapping murders, and the abduction of a child. No graphic detail.

The Interview

This is not an interview with Ivan Milat, who is not heard. It is a Ten News segment from Sydney, broadcast in December 2010 during the last week in the newsroom of the network's veteran crime reporter, Harry Potter. After a studio introduction, Potter previews his final stories and then presents a report on New South Wales prisoners serving life. The first part concerns Milat and includes two short comments from Clive Small, the retired police officer who led the task force that caught him.

Historical Context

In 1992 and 1993, the bodies of seven young backpackers, five women and two men, were found in Belanglo State Forest, south-west of Sydney. New South Wales Police set up Task Force Air in October 1993 under Superintendent Clive Small. Milat was arrested on May 22, 1994, charged with the seven murders on May 31, 1994, and convicted on July 27, 1996. He received a life sentence for each murder, without the possibility of parole.

Circumstances

The report aired in December 2010, weeks after the November 2010 murder of a teenager in Belanglo State Forest by Milat's great-nephew and another youth had renewed attention on Milat (that case is not mentioned in the video). Harry Potter, who first joined Ten Eyewitness News in 1978, was in his last week in the newsroom, as the newsreader says.

What the Recording Covers

Potter says the task force believed Milat, then 65, killed others beyond the seven backpackers. Clive Small says: "I think the view generally is that there were probably another three or four murders for which Ivan was responsible, but the fact of the matter is that there is simply not enough evidence there to charge him with those matters." Potter notes that Small could not identify these victims, and Small rejects speculation that Milat had help: "My view very strongly is that Ivan acted alone in all of the cases." The report then turns to other prisoners serving life in New South Wales: Malcolm Baker, Sef Gonzales and Bruce Burrell, convicted of the murders of Kerry Whelan (whom he also kidnapped) and Dorothy Davis, whose bodies have never been found. It says 41 of the state's life-term prisoners had been ordered never to be released, and closes with a victims of crime advocate arguing that the figure should be higher.

What Makes the Recording Significant

It records, on camera, the view of the man who led the Milat investigation that Milat was probably responsible for "another three or four murders" that could not be proved, and his firm opinion that Milat acted alone.

Archival Importance

A contemporaneous Ten News segment from the end of a long Sydney crime-reporting career. Small's comments are brief, but they are a primary statement of the investigators' view on unproven Milat cases.

Important Caveats

Milat is not heard. The further murders are police suspicions only: Milat was never charged with any murder other than the seven backpacker murders, and Small himself says no victims can be identified and there was not enough evidence to charge him. The video's title ("Inside The Ivan Milat Task Force") overstates the content: only about 55 seconds of the 2:47 concern Milat, and the description's "four additional murders" is Potter's figure; Small says "three or four." The uploading channel could not be confirmed as Network Ten's own. The interviewee at 01:46 and the victims of crime representative at 02:23 are not named in the recording. The broadcast date is inferred.

Ten News Newsreader: Ten's veteran crime reporter Harry Potter has been breaking stories for more than three decades. This, sadly, is his last week here in the newsroom, and that's where he joins us from now. He wouldn't be comfortable anywhere else. Harry, you're not going quietly, though. What do you have in store for us this week?

Harry Potter: A couple of interesting things, Bill. Later in the week, a look at television coverage of crime and how it's changed so quickly over the years. On Wednesday, the tragic story of the (family name withheld) family in Newcastle: their daughter, (name withheld), vanished, kidnapped off the street 16 years ago. They don't know whether she's alive or dead, and they're heading into their 16th Christmas without her. And tonight, the one and only Ivan Milat, and the four murders police think he committed in addition to the other seven backpackers, but they couldn't prove it.

Harry Potter: The beast of Belanglo, Ivan Milat, is serving seven life terms for the backpacker murders. Five young women and two men were all victims of the serial killer, but the task force that finally nailed him believes others died at the hands of the 65-year-old. Lead investigator Clive Small has since retired.

Clive Small: I think the view generally is that there were probably another three or four murders for which Ivan was responsible, but the fact of the matter is that there is simply not enough evidence there to charge him with those matters.

Harry Potter: While unable to identify these victims, Small dismissed speculation Milat didn't act alone.

Clive Small: My view very strongly is that Ivan acted alone in all of the cases.

Harry Potter: Also killing time in Goulburn's supermax (second machine pass; first pass "Corbyn's") is Malcolm Baker, who shot dead six at Terrigal, among them a pregnant young woman. While locked up for life in Lithgow is the cunning Sef Gonzales, who stabbed his family to death.

Interviewee: It's still very vivid in my mind what I saw that night.

Harry Potter: Very, very difficult for you.

Interviewee: Yeah.

Harry Potter: But just as cruel were the kidnapping murders. The bodies of Kerry Whelan and Dorothy Davis have never been found. Bruce Burrell was convicted of both crimes, but still refuses to say [unclear: "where the" / "whether"] two Sydney women are buried. Kerry's husband Bernie and his family are still struggling to cope. 41 of the state's life-term prisoners have been sentenced to die behind bars in New South Wales, their crimes so serious, the judge ruling they were not entitled to parole. Our victims of crime group maintains the figure should be much higher.

Victims Of Crime Group Representative: [unclear: "Seeing" / "Since"] each year in New South Wales detectives are called upon to investigate no less than 60 to 80 homicides. It's just not fair. And what's more, I don't actually believe that is reflecting the views that we are constantly being told, that murder is the most serious crime.

Harry Potter: Harry Potter, 10 News. [No further speech found from about 02:42 to the end of the clip at 02:47.] ---