Early on the morning of September 13, 2016, a woman whispered to an Ashland County dispatcher that she had been abducted, that the man who had taken her was asleep beside her, and that she was using his phone. Officers broke into a house on Covert Court in Ashland, Ohio, that had been listed as vacant, freed her, and arrested Shawn Grate, an occasional drifter who had been living there. Within hours he was telling detectives that there were two dead women in the house, one in a closet upstairs and one in the basement, and he was right.
Stacey Stanley was 43, the mother of two sons, and had last been seen on September 8. Elizabeth Griffith, 29, had disappeared from a Walmart parking lot in Ashland on August 16. Over the days that followed Grate took detectives to the body of Candice Cunningham, 29, whom he had dated, in neighboring Richland County, and admitted killing Rebekah Leicy, 31, whose death in 2015 had been put down to an overdose, and a woman he remembered only as Dana or Diana, identified by DNA in 2019 as Dana Nicole Lowrey, 23, of Louisiana. Detectives Kim Mager and Brian Evans questioned him for roughly 33 hours across eight days, and he pleaded guilty to the last three killings in 2019.
In May 2018 a jury in the Ashland County Court of Common Pleas watched days of these recordings and convicted him of the aggravated murders of Stacey Stanley and Elizabeth Griffith, and on June 1 Judge Ronald Forsthoefel sentenced him to death. When his automatic appeal reached the Supreme Court of Ohio, the State answered with a 357-page merit brief, filed on January 10, 2020, that quotes his answers at length. The passages below are those quotations. The court upheld the conviction and the death sentence that December.
These are not the interviews. They are 179 passages that the State of Ohio chose to quote in its brief because they helped its argument, printed here in the order the brief prints them. Nothing tells us what was said between one passage and the next, and several begin in the middle of an exchange. 32 passages carry the State's own citation to a trial exhibit and transcript page, which is where the full recordings can be found; the rest follow the same exhibits without repeating the citation. The questioners are Detectives Mager and Evans, Captain David Lay and Officer Dorsey of the Ashland police, and the names in square brackets, such as [Shawn Grate], were put in by the State.
In 128 of the passages the text stops in the middle of a sentence. In the brief those sentences run on to the next page, and the copy we worked from did not follow them there, so the rest of each sentence is missing here and has not been guessed at. What Grate says in these passages was put to the jury as his confession and has been tested by two courts. It remains his account, given in custody, of what he did to women who cannot answer it.
The woman who escaped and called 911 has never been publicly identified. Grate uses her first name 31 times in these passages, and each time it reads [name withheld]. Two other women he mentions who have nothing to do with the crimes are treated the same way, six times in all, and a telephone number he gives has been taken out. The names of the five dead women stand.
The brief is a public filing by the State of Ohio in the Supreme Court of Ohio, case 2018-0968, and is served from that court's own online docket; the interview transcripts it quotes were trial exhibits in State of Ohio v. Shawn M. Grate, No. 16C-CRI-187. There is no private rights holder. The recordings and complete transcripts, State's Exhibits 263 to 335, can be requested from the Clerk of Courts in Ashland County under the Ohio Public Records Act.
The text came from the brief's own text layer, not from a scan, so there are no reading errors in it and no spelling has been touched, including the court reporter's "(phonetic)" after names spelled by ear. We removed the brief's page layout and indentation and joined each question and answer that the page had broken across lines. There are 600 questions and 594 answers.
Excerpt 1
Q. [Ashland Police Detective Kim Mager] Okay. Because I think you called yourself an opportunist once to me, I’m going to paraphrase this, correct me when I’m wrong, okay? So, I’m going to use, so, let’s take, um, Stacey, she didn’t come in there wanting, wanting to die, right?
A. [Shawn Grate] Hmm.
Q. Because you had plans that night, she didn’t, she didn’t come in there for that, so, when she’s in there, it has to be inside you already that this, this is heading that way, this is going to end bad –
A. Enthralled.
Q. -- and it just is a wait for you, it’s just a wait for her to make the mistake or tell me the, going from it might happen, to it’s going to happen, what’s in your mind, like what has to happen for her, what happens there for the switch to happen?
Excerpt 2
A. No, when she lied to me.
Q. About, when you called her, when you call her out on it?
A. Yeah.
Q. So, --
A. Like different guys and she just took defense already like, yeah,
Excerpt 3
Cited as: St. Ex. 327, Grate Interview at the Ashland jail with Ashland Police Detective Kim
Q. She what?
A. She was angry I'm sure.
Q. Yeah.
A. She maced me.
Excerpt 4
Q. Is there?
A. [Shawn Grate] Yeah, I had a job.
Q. Oh, really. Where are you working?
A. Well, I was working at Save-a-Lot, then I got an interview at Circle K, I haven’t
Excerpt 5
Q. Okay. How long did you stay in the woods?
A. About two weeks, maybe more.
Q. Did you have a tent or anything?
A. No, I built forts.
Q. Oh, okay.
A. Yeah, to pass time.
Q. Okay. So, that was, ah, maybe like the beginning of August roughly, around
Excerpt 6
Cited as: St. Ex. 264, Grate Interview at the Covert Court house with Ashland Ofc. Dorsey, September 13, 2016, Tr. 7
A. July.
Q. Oh, July, okay.
A. Well, actually July 4th I stayed in these woods and watched the fireworks.
Q. Okay.
A. And then it was like a month later.
Q. And then a month later you ended up here?
A. June.
Q. June?
A. June, June is when it all started.
Excerpt 7
Cited as: St. Ex. 264, Grate Interview at the Covert Court house with Ashland Ofc. Dorsey, September 13, 2016, Tr. 8-9.
A. About.
Q. The electric works and everything?
A. The electric don't, the electric works, nothing else.
Q. Oh, nothing else, no water or anything?
A. No, but I get water from here --
Q. Okay.
A. -- the laundry mat.
Q. Okay. Just take it in in buckets or something?
A. Yeah gallons
Q. Okay.
A. -- a gallon of water.
Q. How do you, how do you shower and stuff?
A. By a gallon of water or two.
Excerpt 8
Cited as: St. Ex. 264, Grate Interview at the Covert Court house with Ashland Ofc. Dorsey, September 13, 2016, Tr. 9-10.
Q. Oh, the big, the big abandoned building?
A. Mm.
Q. How long did you stay in there?
A. About a week.
Excerpt 9
Cited as: St. Ex. 264, Grate Interview at the Covert Court house with Ashland Ofc. Dorsey, September 13, 2016, Tr. 11.
Q. What's her name, that girl, I don't even know her name?
A. [name withheld].
Q. Okay. And how do you know her again?
A. We've spent a lot of time lately together, ah, we go eat lunch every day.
Q. Okay. Here in Ashland?
A. Yeah.
Q. Where do you guys normally go?
A. Kroc Center.
Q. Okay. Does she meet you there or do you guys go together?
A. I go to her place to pick her up on my feet.
Excerpt 10
A. Once I went to the Kroc Center --
Q. Oh, you went to the Kroc, okay.
A. -- and had lunch --
Q. So, you met her at the Kroc Center?
A. -- she introduced herself, yeah.
Q. Okay.
A. We've just been going and playing tennis and stuff.
Q. Where do you play tennis?
A. That park down here at the very - - about a 20-minute walk
Q. Okay.
A. -- not even that far.
Q. What's, what's by it, there's a couple different tennis courts?
A. I was wondering that, if there was more tennis courts.
Q. What, what's by it, the tennis courts that you play?
A. Brookfield maybe, Brook, there's a swimming pool out there.
Q. Okay. So, you go to the Brookside Park?
A. Is that it, Brookside, okay, yeah.
Excerpt 11
A. Four times.
Q. Four times?
A. Maybe.
Q. Maybe, okay.
A. Around there.
Q. So, other than playing tennis together and going to the Kroc Center for lunch
Excerpt 12
A. A couple times.
Q. Okay. So, it's not like an every day thing?
A. We could get married and divorced in a day.
Q. Okay, got you. You haven't popped the question or anything, it's just kind of
Excerpt 13
Cited as: St. Ex. 264, Grate Interview at the Covert Court house with Ashland Ofc. Dorsey, September 13, 2016, Tr. 18-19.
A. Yeah, it's just been an open discussion.
Q. Okay. So, how long would you say you've actually known her?
A. Oh, God, July.
Q. Since July?
A. Mm.
Q. Okay. And have you started seeing each other like more frequently?
A. About every day.
Q. About every day now?
A. Yeah.
Q. How did it start out, did it start out every day and you guys kind of --
A. It started with, I’d, I'd be busy for a few days --
Q. Okay.
A. -- I did get a job at Save-A-Lot, I’ve been working.
Excerpt 14
Q. What's her name, that girl, I don't even know her name?
A. [name withheld].
Q. Okay. And how do you know her again?
A. We've spent a lot of time lately together, ah, we go eat lunch every day.
Q. Okay. Here in Ashland?
A. Yeah.
Q. Where do you guys normally go?
A. Kroc Center.
Q. Okay. Does she meet you there or do you guys go together?
A. I go to her place to pick her up on my feet.
Q. Oh, you walk, okay. Um, where does she live?
A. Those apartments down here.
Q. Like on Cleveland Avenue, Almond Tree?
A. Hmm.
Q. No, what are they by, do you know any landmarks or anything?
A. By Circle K to the left.
Q. The one on Main?
A. Mm.
Q. Are you talking about Village Green, Stoney Creek?
A. No, Stoney Creek, yeah, I'm not too sure actually.
Q. Is it like a big apartment complex where there's a bunch of buildings?
Excerpt 15
A. Mm.
Q. Right off Main Street?
A. Yeah, they have some around the back.
Q. Yeah, it's probably, you cross a creek
A. Yeah.
Q. -- to get to it?
A. Yep.
Q. Yeah, okay, that's Stoney Creek.
A. She lives there.
Q. Got you, okay. So, you would walk there, you guys meet up there and then walk
Excerpt 16
A. Mm.
Q. Now, did you know her before coming to Ashland?
A. No, I just met her.
Q. Oh, you just met her, okay. Like how long ago would you say?
A. I met her since I've been in Ashland.
Q. Since you've been in Ashland, so, right away, so, even, even when you were
Excerpt 17
Q. So, you met her at the Kroc Center?
A. -- she introduced herself, yeah.
Q. Okay.
A. We've just been going and playing tennis and stuff.
Q. Where do you play tennis?
A. That park down here at the very - - about a 20-minute walk
Q. Okay.
A. -- not even that far.
Q. What's, what's by it, there's a couple different tennis courts?
A. I was wondering that, if there was more tennis courts.
Q. What, what's by it, the tennis courts that you play?
A. Brookfield maybe, Brook, there's a swimming pool out there.
Q. Okay. So, you go to the Brookside Park?
A. Is that it, Brookside, okay, yeah.
Q. Okay. That's where you guys would play tennis, how many times do you think
Excerpt 18
A. Four times.
Q. Four times?
A. Maybe.
Q. Maybe, okay.
A. Around there.
Excerpt 19
Q. Okay. So, how long would you say you've actually known her?
A. Oh, God, July.
Q. Since July?
A. Mm.
Q. Okay. And have you started seeing each other like more frequently?
A. About every day.
Q. About every day now?
A. Yeah.
Q. How did it start out, did it start out every day and you guys kind of
A. It started with, I’d, I'd be busy for a few days --
Q. Okay.
A. -- I did get a job at Save-A-Lot, I 1ve been working.
Q. Right. So, would you consider that you guys are basically dating then?
A. Yeah.
Q. Okay. Because before you, you mentioned that she was a friend, but it sounds
Excerpt 20
A. Yeah, she's one of my best friends.
Q. -- if you're talking, if you're talking marriage, then pretty much dating, right?
A. Yeah.
Q. Okay. So, you guys have obviously been intimate together?
A. No.
Q. You haven't, I mean you guys are staying together, right?
Excerpt 21
A. Hmm.
Q. -- you guys are talking marriage and she's never stayed the night?
A. I’ve never, I’ve never been in her apartment, but I stand at the door.
Q. Okay. You’ve never been inside?
A. Too much temptation, we have temptation, we avoid that, we try not to be
Excerpt 22
Q. You initiate it first or she did?
A. I don't initiate it because I know how she is.
Q. How’s that, because she wants to wait?
A. Yeah, because she wants to wait --
Q. Okay.
Excerpt 23
Cited as: St. Ex. 264, Grate Interview at the Covert Court house with Ashland Ofc. Dorsey, September 13, 2016, Tr. 18-21.
Q. So, were you - -
A. -- asking her how her day was and everything.
Q. Right. Is this like a daily thing where she comes and sits on your lap - -
A. Mm.
Q. -- when, when did she --
A. Just recently when she really realized that she wanted to marry me.
Q. Okay. So, within the past couple of weeks?
A. Yeah.
Q. Okay. You guys hold hands and kiss and stuff like that?
A. Hmm.
Q. None of that?
A. Nothing, it’s okay.
Q. She just sits on your lap, what’s she do when she’s sitting on your lap?
A. Talk.
Excerpt 24
A. [Shawn Grate] At the Kroc Center.
Q. How long ago?
A. About two months ago.
Q. Okay. What were you doing there to meet her?
A. Ah, they do serve lunch every day through Monday through Friday --
Q. Mm.
A. -- so, I met her there, um, about two months ago or less, when I first got to
Excerpt 25
Q. Where are you from?
A. Um, I came from Mansfield.
Q. What's the deal with, ah, so, you're living where, there on Covert since you 've
Excerpt 26
A. Ah, maybe about a month over there.
Q. But you've been living there in Covert?
A. Is that the duplex?
Q. Covert, yeah.
Excerpt 27
Cited as: St. Ex. 280, Grate Interview at the Ashland jail with Captain David Lay, before 10:53 AM, September 13, 2016, Tr. 4-5.
A. Yeah.
Q. Where you were at this morning?
A. Mm.
Q. Okay. Whose house is it?
A. I'm not too sure.
Q. So, you're just like squatting in there?
A. Yeah.
Excerpt 28
A. Around 24 hours.
Q. Okay. Where did you meet her to bring her back to the house?
A. Her place.
Q. Where does she live?
A. She lives in, um, I think, I don ' t know what them apartments are called, right
Excerpt 29
Q. Oh, off of Holbrook, Stoney Creek, the apartments back in there?
A. I think those are, might be Stoney Creek.
Q. Yeah, I think that's where you ' re talking about. So, how did you get there, I
Excerpt 30
A. Walk.
Q. -- to her apartment? Okay. And then you take her where?
A. Ah, we walked around and we went back to where I was staying.
Q. Okay.
A. We kind of started fooling around a little bit and then things got carried away.
Q. Explain carried away?
A. Um, like, no, don't, do you know what I mean, we're not ready for that, which
Excerpt 31
A. Yeah.
Q. Now, what's she meaning when she's saying that?
A. What?
Q. When she says, no, what's she talking about?
A. Oh, she didn't really say, no, she's like, oh, stop it, you know, we're, we're not
Excerpt 32
Q. You don't fool around, you're talking intercourse?
A. Anything.
Q. Anything, okay, all right.
A. No kissing or anything, I just like went to give her a little tap on the back, you
Excerpt 33
Q. So, did you guys have sex?
A. Yeah, we ended up having sex.
Q. Against her will?
A. Well, it ended up she didn't like it and she's really beating herself up about it,
Excerpt 34
Q. Okay. And you were in the middle of sex when you punched her?
A. Hmm, no, we weren't, the sex, with her fighting and everything, we made up, we had sex.
Q. After you punched her?
A. Yeah.
Q. Okay. Now, you know, we talked about honesty earlier, okay, I mean she's
Excerpt 35
Cited as: St. Ex. 280, Grate Interview at the Ashland jail with Ashland police Captain David Lay, before 10:53 AM, September 13, 2016, Tr. 10.
A. She may not have wanted to have sex like afterwards.
Q. After what?
A. After I hit her.
Q. How many times did you have sex?
A. Um, it ended up being a few times within 24 hours.
Q. Mm.
A. Yeah, I mean I don't, I don't think it really was against her, her will.
Excerpt 36
Q. Okay. So, we're talking over 24 hours then that you've been with her, right?
A. Sunday evening, yeah, times since I've been asleep –
Q. So, you've got --
A. -- you can ask her about it.
Q. -- so, you've been with her since Sunday evening?
A. Yeah, Sunday evening.
Q. Okay. Can you tie down a time when you guys got together?
A. 6 o'clock probably in the evening.
Q. Okay. You go straight to the apartment, um, she's saying you tied her down
Excerpt 37
Q. Do you know, how many of [name withheld]'s friends do you know?
A. I met someone the other day.
Q. Who's that?
A. I think her, her name is, maybe [name withheld] I think it was and [name withheld], not [name withheld], but,
Excerpt 38
Q. Did you ever hook up with her?
A. Hmm, no.
Q. Did you ever try to?
A. No, not like that.
Q. Not like that, how?
A. Oh, I don't see her like that, hooking up with her.
Q. How do you see her?
A. Just trying to find her way.
Q. I don't, what do you mean?
A. I mean just trying to, I don't know, she talks constantly just for like the five
Excerpt 39
Q. What does she talk about?
A. Ah, the, ah, the mental hospital and stuff that she’s dealing with.
Q. Yeah, she had some issues, she is missing.
A. That's what I heard.
Q. How did you hear that?
Excerpt 40
A. Um, through [name withheld] at the Kroc Center, [name withheld].
Q. Mm.
A. Um, through [name withheld].
Q. [name withheld] told you that?
A. Yeah, and her friend that we met the other day.
Q. Who's the friend?
A. I think her name is [name withheld], [name withheld] knows, [name withheld] knows because she picked us up
Excerpt 41
Q. Okay. What did [name withheld] say about Elizabeth?
A. She just don’t know.
Q. Don’t know what?
A. She’s thinking that she was at the mental hospital somewhere, she didn't
Excerpt 42
A. Yeah.
Q. So, when was the last time you had contact with her?
A. I haven't had no contact with her.
Q. Because it kind of makes me wonder if, since [name withheld]'s talked about her and you've
Excerpt 43
A. I understand with the [name withheld] situation.
Q. Yeah, I mean it kind of looks funny, it looks strange.
A. What does she, I mean do you know what's going on?
Q. No, I really don't, I'm hoping you can help me because if, if there's any kind of
Excerpt 44
Cited as: St. Ex. 280, Grate Interview at the Ashland jail with Ashland police Captain David Lay, before 10:53 AM, September 13, 2016, Tr. 22-23.
Q. So, you tie [[name withheld]’s] arm under her leg, why that position?
A. One tie, she's not able to move.
Q. Is she tied down to the mattress from the other side?
A. No, not until I had to leave.
Q. So, you left at some point, when was that?
A. About 8 o’clock to 9 o’clock.
Q. A.m. or p.m.?
A. P.m.
Q. On Sunday or Monday?
A. Monday.
Q. So, when you left, you tied her down to the mattress, why?
A. Just for cigarettes, I just left for cigarettes, then I came back and untied her.
Q. But why did you tie her when you left?
A. So, she wouldn’t leave.
Q. So, she couldn’t leave?
A. Yeah, I wasn’t ready for her to leave yet.
Q. Where did you walk to get cigarettes?
A. Duke.
Q. Duke, what, Main and Union
A. -- Main, yes.
Excerpt 45
A. At the Grain Mill.
Q. The Grain Mill, where's that at?
A. You know where the brick road is on Orange Street?
Q. Mm, off of Orange, yeah.
A. That building, it has green wood.
Q. I think that's the old Hess & Clark building I think they call it, I thinks that's
Excerpt 46
A. Yeah, I heard that, that's what it is.
Q. You've heard it called that?
A. Yeah.
Q. So, you stayed in there?
A. Mm.
Q. For how long?
A. A week.
Q. Is that where you first stayed when you came to town or where did you first
Excerpt 47
Q. By the church?
A. Out that way.
Q. What church?
A. That gravel road that goes into -- from Orange to that gravel road to Orange it
Excerpt 48
Q. You're talking the railroad tracks?
A. By the railroad tracks.
Q. Okay. Right there behind Circle K, you stayed in that woods back in there?
A. Yeah, just for about three days.
Q. Do you have a tent or something or you just lay, I mean?
A. Okay. Where's your sleeping bag at now?
A. It's probably up in the old Hess & Clark building.
Q. Still up in there?
A. Yeah.
Q. Okay. So, you stayed in the woods for three days behind or around the tracks
Excerpt 49
A. In that building.
Q. The Hess & Clark building?
A. Mm.
Q. So, when you're in town, you say you got in town you think mid when?
A. July.
Q. Okay. And what, in relationship to July 4th, where was it to that holiday?
Excerpt 50
Cited as: St. Ex. 280, Grate Interview at the Ashland jail with Ashland police Captain David Lay, before 10:53 AM, September 13, 2016, Tr. 30-32.
A. Eighth.
Q. Oh, you know what day you got into town, the 8th somewhere?
A. I'm just assuming it was probably three, four, five days after
Q. After the fourth?
A. -- after the 4th of July.
Q. Okay, okay.
A. Yeah.
Q. And you were in the Hess & Clark building for a week you said, where did you
Excerpt 51
Cited as: St. Ex. 280, Grate Interview at the Ashland jail with Ashland police Captain David Lay, before 10:53 AM, September 13, 2016, Tr. 36.
Q. Well, you should be proud of that, trying to find a job?
A. I'm proud of it, a challenge.
Q. What kind of work you do?
A. Well, I was at Save-A-Lot when I first got here.
Q. You worked at Save-A-Lot here in Ashland?
A. Mm.
Q. For how long?
A. Three weeks.
Q. How come you got, did you get - - why aren't you there anymore?
A. I quit.
Excerpt 52
Q. So, that's when you tied her up?
A. Yes, that's when I tied her up.
Q. And what time did you go get cigarettes?
A. I'm not exactly sure, I might have went to Circle K, that's what, ah, I think
Excerpt 53
Cited as: St. Ex. 280, Grate Interview at the Ashland jail with Ashland police Captain David Lay, before 10:53 AM, September 13, 2016, Tr. 47.
Q. Before --
A. Circle K is Monday, I went.
Q. So, after you tied her up, you went to Circle K to get the cigarettes, you say you
Excerpt 54
A. She's crazy.
Q. How do you know that? Help me out here, Shawn, help yourself?
A. She's crazy.
Q. Where's she at?
A. You already know where she is, you don't know where she is?
A. No.
Q. Where's she at? Shawn, you know where she's at, where's she at?
A. She's set free, no more problems, she don't have to cry no more.
Q. How did you set her free?
A. Because she jumped on my back.
Q. What happened?
A. She kept crying to me, I’d say, yeah, it's what you make of this world and
Excerpt 55
A. Didn't talk to her.
Q. Hmm, when did you talk to her?
A. [name withheld] was with us.
Q. When was this?
A. Maybe a month, a week ago or so.
Q. Where did you talk to her at?
A. In front of the yard out there playing badminton, it's just a sad situation, I
Excerpt 56
Q. Well, how did you help her find peace?
A. To move, to clear her mind, just let her like relax, don't worry about things.
Q. How did you accomplish this?
A. Maybe a month, a week ago or so.
Q. Where did you talk to her at?
A. In front of the yard out there playing badminton, it's just a sad situation, I
Excerpt 57
Q. Well, how did you help her find peace?
A. To move, to clear her mind, just let her like relax, don't worry about things.
Q. How did you accomplish this?
A. Just talking to her and then, then I hear she's missing.
Q. You told, you said that, you asked me if I knew where she was, you know where
Excerpt 58
Q. Did you tell [name withheld] what you did with her?
A. I didn't do nothing with her.
Q. Did you tell [name withheld] how you helped her find peace?
A. No, not really because, well, I mean in different words I helped her find, I
Excerpt 59
Cited as: St. Ex. 280, Grate Interview at the Ashland jail with Ashland police Captain David Lay, before 10:53 AM, September 13, 2016, Tr. 58.
Q. So, where's Elizabeth?
A. I'm not too sure where Elizabeth is.
Q. Do you know what happened to her?
A. No, all I've heard is a couple -- like two weeks ago she come up missing.
Excerpt 60
Cited as: St. Ex. 280, Grate Interview at the Ashland jail with Ashland police Captain David Lay, before 10:53 AM, September 13, 2016, Tr. 60.
A. Yeah.
Q. Yeah, what?
A. I acted like a video, might, yeah, there might have been a video.
Q. So, where's your cell phone?
A. It should be around there.
Excerpt 61
Q. [[name withheld]’s] saying that you duct taped her mouth.
A. That's when I went to the gas station.
Q. You put duct tape on [[name withheld]’s] mouth, so, you tie her to what the bed, and then
Excerpt 62
Q. And did you take the duct tape off her mouth?
A. Mm.
Q. She said you were freaking out because you couldn't find the duct tape and the
Excerpt 63
Cited as: St. Ex. 282, Grate Interview at the Ashland jail with Ashland police detective Kim Mager, 10:53 AM, September 13, 2016, Tr. 9-10.
Q. She was scared, right?
A. Yeah.
Q. Yeah.
A. So, I just went, attacked her.
Excerpt 64
A. Just angry.
Q. Just angry, angry because of what you did?
A. Yeah.
Q. Did you have any, anything to - - that you could set it on fire with, did you have
Excerpt 65
Q. What I know, you guys, you guys met how long ago?
A. Maybe two months ago.
Q. Okay. And where did you meet?
A. We met at the Pump House.
Q. Okay.
A. The Kroc Center.
Q. Kroc Center. Did you go there to eat or what were you doing there, having,
Excerpt 66
Cited as: St. Ex. 282, Grate Interview at the Ashland jail with Ashland police detective Kim Mager, 10:53 AM, September 13, 2016, Tr. 27-28.
Q. So, you thought if I hit her, she'll snap out of it and submit?
A. She didn't still submit.
Q. She didn't, she still tried to fight?
A. She stopped when I did, I hit her, she stopped, I stunned her.
Q. Yeah, you stunned her. Did her mouth bleed?
A. Yeah, I split her with the tooth, it must have been.
Excerpt 67
Cited as: St. Ex. 282, Grate Interview at the Ashland jail with Ashland police detective Kim Mager, 10:53 AM, September 13, 2016, Tr. 31-32.
A. Oh, I just lied to her, I was –
Q. All right.
A. -- I found some car keys and I showed her them.
Q. You found some car keys?
A. Yeah, like a car key, I found a car key.
Q. Where did you find it?
A. In, down by the Circle K. I said I was going to leave, drive and leave….
Excerpt 68
Q. But you're five times as strong as her, am I right, is that right or wrong?
A. Yeah.
Q. That's kind of a given, right? So, she doesn't have the option of not -- she tried
Excerpt 69
A. I don't know what you're talking about right now.
Q. I'm looking for Elizabeth's body, can you take me to it?
A. She, she's dead?
Q. I believe she is. Hey --
A. Maybe it's another other guy, just because I did this one, you know, doesn't
Excerpt 70
Q. Hey --
A. -- I mean.
Q. -- listen to me, this is your moment.
A. Is it my moment?
Q. I believe it is.
A. My moment is when I die, once I'm put in a cell, the key locks, is my moment.
Q. We don't want, we don't -- listen, things are never the way they look at face
Excerpt 71
A. I don' t know, let's just say many.
Q. What?
A. I don't know, there might not be none. You say Elizabeth's dead?
Q. What?
A. You think that she is dead?
Q. I believe she is, I don't know 100 percent, I'm honest with you, I think she is.
A. Why don't you know 100 percent?
Q. What?
A. Why don't you know 100 percent?
Q. Because we haven't found her. Hey, you know how bad your parents hurt you,
Excerpt 72
Cited as: St. Ex. 282, Grate Interview at the Ashland jail with Ashland police detective Kim Mager, 10:53 AM, September 13, 2016, Tr. 46-47.
A. I don't know where she is.
Q. Tell me why you don't know that?
A. Out of my hands, I don't –
Q. What do you, what do you mean?
A. I don't know where she is, I don't know where she is or what she's doing, I just
Excerpt 73
Q. Okay.
A. How many before lethal injections?
Q. How many what?
A. How many people before I get lethal injected?
Q. Let's not worry about any of that.
A. Okay.
Q. ****
A. Well, I already mentioned her.
Q. Who are you thinking of?
A. The house, the home.
Q. The house what?
A. The house where I came from.
Q. Yeah. Is somebody in there?
A. Yeah.
Q. Who is it, is it Elizabeth?
A. Yeah.
Q. Where is she in there?
Excerpt 74
A. In the closet.
Q. In the closet? Which closet?
A. Upstairs.
Q. Upstairs.
A. Yeah.
Q. What happened?
A. I do, I love, I care, I hate seeing people suffer.
Q. Okay.
A. That's it.
Q. Okay, all right, Shawn.
A. Nothing's safe for her or nothing, I didn't hurt her.
Q. Okay. How did you do it, Shawn?
A. Well, she wanted more, she didn't at first, I was like well, what the heck,
Excerpt 75
A. The closet.
Q. I mean do you have her put -- did you put her in anything?
A. Just a bunch of clothes.
Q. A bunch of clothes?
A. I threw in there, flies are in there --
Q. Flies?
A. -- flies like crazy.
Q. You mean the house that you're staying in right now?
Q. All right. Which closet, what room?
A. Upstairs, the one beside the bathroom.
Excerpt 76
Cited as: St. Ex. 282, Grate Interview at the Ashland jail with Ashland police detective Kim Mager, 10:53 AM, September 13, 2016, Tr. 57-60.
Q. Can you, is there an odor?
A. Yeah, there's an odor.
Q. Is there, okay.
A. There's an odor.
Excerpt 77
Q. [Detective Mager] With Elizabeth, is she nude or is she in clothes?
A. [Shawn Grate] Well, when, she took her shirt off, right --
Q. Okay.
A. -- I was just showing her around then, she wanted, she insisted to look around,
Excerpt 78
Q. Yeah.
A. -- I didn't feel that.
Q. Yeah. Did you end up having sex with her?
A. No, I did not.
Q. Okay.
A. I didn't do nothing with her at all.
Q. So, when it came to the point that --
A. I was struggling, you know, her, her shirt did end up coming off, no.
Q. Okay. How did it come off?
Excerpt 79
A. I was moving it like, like choking her.
Q. You were choking her?
A. Yeah.
Q. Did you choke her from the front or choke her from behind?
A. Well, it just happened that I choked her, I just reached up and just choked her,
Excerpt 80
Q. Yeah.
A. -- so, I put a little fear in them, right?
Q. Yeah.
A. She fought it like, I was like it's not what you want, then she like started
Excerpt 81
A. You panicked?
Q. Mm.
Q. Then you just did it again?
A. I didn't have no other choice. Just slow, like calm her down because I mean she
Excerpt 82
Q. So, did you strangle her again, is that how she died or is there another way?
A. No, that's the way she died.
Q. That's the way, was that on your, your bed?
A. The bed upstairs.
Q. It was upstairs, is there a bed in that room?
A. Yeah.
Q. Okay. And then was that during the day or at night?
A. This was like, she came over about 11 o'clock when she brought over Yahtzee,
Excerpt 83
Q. 11 o'clock at night, so, you guys played Yahtzee and then what happened?
A. She couldn't sleep, so, she called me.
Q. Okay. What do you have her in your phone as?
A. I don't think I have her, I think I just gave her my number, I didn't even give
Excerpt 84
Q. Yeah.
A. -- like I really could just smack her, wake up.
Q. So, after she died, did you immediately put her in the closet or what happened
Excerpt 85
Q. Are there any other girls in the house right now?
A. Mm.
Q. Yeah?
A. There's one down in the basement.
Q. Down in the basement, and what's she in?
A. She’s just down in the basement.
Q. She's just down in the basement?
A. Yeah.
Q. Tell me about it.
A. She just led me on to the point of there was no stopping and it really irritated
Excerpt 86
Q. What's her name?
A. Stacey.
Q. Stacey, what's her last name?
A. I don't remember right now, Stacey.
Q. Where's she from?
A. Frankington (phonetic), I'm not sure where she's from, I'm trying to remember.
Q. Okay. How did you meet her?
A. Walking to the gas station.
Excerpt 87
Q. Okay. When did that happen?
A. I'm not sure, Thursday.
Q. Thursday, well, let's look, let's look at our calendar again.
A. Thank you.
Q. You're welcome. Let's find it here. All right. Here's September, today's the
Excerpt 88
A. Okay.
Q. What day do you think this happened with Stacey?
A. Probably Thursday.
Q. Probably Thursday?
A. Let's see, it's still, it's kind of, it's hard for me to say.
Q. Right around that day though you think?
A. The Thursday, maybe it was Thursday.
Q. Is that the day you met her, when you were walking by the --
A. I met her Thursday, yeah --
Q. Okay.
A. -- it happened Friday night, I mean Thursday morning, ah, I don't know what
Excerpt 89
Q. We'll get her last name.
A. I'm trying to remember her last name.
Q. What did she look like?
A. She's a sweet lady though.
Excerpt 90
Q. Sweet lady?
A. Yeah.
Q. What color hair does she have?
A. Black.
Q. Black hair, about how old is she?
A. Young.
Q. Young?
A. 42.
Q. 42?
A. 45 or 43 or something like that.
Q. Okay. Does she have a car?
A. Mm.
Q. Are those the keys that you have?
A. Yeah.
Q. Those are the keys that you have?
A. Yeah.
Q. Where's her car?
A. I don't know what street it's on.
Q. Have you been in that car, I mean have you driven it since this happened? And
Excerpt 91
Q. How did, ah, how did she die, like the same way or another way?
A. Tongue out of her mouth.
Q. You what?
A. When you choke a woman out --
Q. Yeah.
A. -- you choke someone, they die with their tongue out of their mouth.
Q. And she put her tongue out of her mouth?
A. Oh, no, just, just the pressure, it makes people's tongues stick out and then
Excerpt 92
Q. Okay.
A. -- automatic.
Q. Yeah. What room did that happen in?
A. Bathroom door, bedroom where I was.
Q. The bedroom where you had [name withheld]?
A. Yeah, then I took her down in the basement.
Q. All right. What is she wearing?
A. I'm not exactly sure.
Q. All right. Did you have sex with her?
A. Yeah.
Q. All right.
A. See at first, kind of like playing around and then she wanted to play that
Excerpt 93
Q. Did you have sex with her before she died or after?
A. No one ever after.
Q. Okay, all right.
A. Nothing’s never happened afterwards.
Q. Okay. So, what did you put her in, in the basement?
A. Just put her on the floor.
Q. Put her on the floor. All right. Is there anything in that freezer down there?
A. Hmm.
Q. Nothing, where, where on the floor in the basement?
A. Underneath all that stuff, garbage.
Q. Okay.
A. Underneath the garbage.
Q. And that’s at the house on, um - -
A. 4th is it?
Q. -- on 4th, right by the laundry?
A. Yeah.
Q. Kind of near the laundry. I'll get her last when I can. Um, is there anybody else
Excerpt 94
Q. All right. Did she try to fight you when you were strangling her?
A. Yeah.
Q. Tell me about that.
A. She even, she maced me too.
Q. She maced you?
A. Well, that's what happened, yeah, she maced me, right, and I just snapped on
Excerpt 95
Q. Have you used your stun gun on, on any of them?
A. No, I don't think it's powerful enough.
Q. Okay.
A. I mainly got that, ah, when I was breaking in the Flea Market in Mifflin--
Q. Okay.
A. -- and there's no one else.
Q. So, there's no other person in that house?
Excerpt 96
A. No.
Q. And who was the last one?
A. Um, victims?
Q. Yeah.
A. [name withheld].
Q. [name withheld], were you going to do the same thing to [name withheld]?
A. Never, no.
Q. What's the difference?
A. Because she will help people.
Q. Because she helps people?
A. She knows how to help people, yeah, and I was told not to, just so, many things,
Excerpt 97
Q. Like what's that feel like directly during and then directly afterwards?
A. Oh, man.
Q. I mean does it feel like a release, does it feel good, does it, be honest, this helps
Excerpt 98
Q. How long did you keep Stacey before she --
A. Oh, just about an hour.
Q. Just about an hour?
A. Short time, yeah, she flipped out, acted up, so, I didn't have a choice.
Q. You didn't have a choice, do you really, I mean think about it, did you have, did
Excerpt 99
Cited as: St. Ex. 286, Grate Interview at the Ashland jail with Ashland police detective Kim Mager, 1:38 PM, September 13, 2016, Tr. 11-12.
A. She knew where I was, um --
Q. Oh, she knew where you were meaning
A. Living.
Q. -- she knew and you had already made her give you oral sex, like forced that
Excerpt 100
Q. Okay.
A. -- just kind of like it just happened and then, I don't know --
Q. Okay.
A. -- it just went all bad.
Q. Yeah. Because it's already happened before and everything's just kind of like
Excerpt 101
A. Oh, yeah, she came with me, we went to the apartment in the back.
Q. Okay. Did you -- did she give you a ride back or did you --
A. Yeah, she gave me a ride back.
Q. Okay. So, at what point while she was there did you decide you're going, that
Excerpt 102
Cited as: St. Ex. 286, Grate Interview at the Ashland jail with Ashland police detective Kim Mager, 1:38 PM, September 13, 2016, Tr. 13-15.
Q. Okay.
A. -- flashbacks like my mom really, I mean I hate to blame people, but --
Q. I know.
A. -- someone has to be blamed, I mean, I'm taking my blame.
Excerpt 103
A. To Ashland.
Q. Okay.
A. And I stayed in the woods in Mifflin for a little while too.
Q. Okay. Where in Mifflin?
A. Ah, like, um, 18, I think 2018 or something, County Road 2018, where you go
Excerpt 104
Q. Okay. So, you stayed in the woods for a little while?
A. I stayed there for three weeks, just walking back and forth, Charles Mill --
Q. Okay.
A. -- to Ashland, yeah.
Q. Were you in the park at Charles Mill some?
A. Mm, why, did you have any complaints over there, mysteries?
Q. No, there's nothing, is there anything over there?
A. There ain't no dead bodies --
Q. Okay.
A. -- just I stayed in people's trailers.
Excerpt 105
Q. You stayed in people's trailers in the park?
A. Mm, Charles Mill.
Q. How did you get in them?
A. Shoot the back window like that and see if they come up.
Q. Why did you do that?
A. I was out there for probably about three or four weeks.
Q. You stayed in the same trailers or went in different ones? How many different
Excerpt 106
Q. Okay. And that was since, what month was that?
A. That was before July, I was back and forth from Mansfield.
Q. I mean were there people that would come to those trailers on the weekends?
A. Luckily, no.
Q. Okay.
A. But they did eventually come, but it just so, happened as I was walking to it I
Excerpt 107
Q. You tied her up after she died?
A. After she let off that big scream, yeah.
Q. She let out a scream when she died?
A. Mm.
Q. Is Stacey also, tied, they have not looked at her yet, she's still in the basement,
Excerpt 108
Q. How far after the video was made did you strangle her?
A. I gave her leeway, right, I sat her mace right there.
Q. Say it again, I 'm sorry?
A. I was on the other the side of the room.
Q. Yeah.
A. Her mace was right there.
Q. Okay.
Excerpt 109
Cited as: St. Ex. 295, Grate Interview at the Ashland jail with Ashland Police Detective Kim Mager and Ashland Police Detective Brian Evans, 2:23 PM,
Q. And that was how long after?
A. 15 minutes.
Q. 15 minutes after the oral sex?
A. Yeah.
Excerpt 110
A. I know.
Q. -- why didn't you do anything to [name withheld]?
A. Well, [name withheld]'s been in there before too, you know.
Q. But with this girl, did you rub her back in there, did you massage her shoulders
Excerpt 111
Q. Why did [name withheld] leave?
A. -- she didn't flip out or anything, I guess it went smooth.
Q. It did.
Excerpt 112
Q. I did.
A. That's all right.
Q. I did, I didn't mean to.
A. I'm not too sure here, what you're talking about.
Q. Okay. She said she talked to you, you gave her your phone number and you
Excerpt 113
A. Is she the 17-year-old that has a kid --
Q. Yes.
A. -- she was a 17-year-old that had a kid?
Q. Yes, did that conversation happen?
A. Yeah, I talked to her.
Excerpt 114
Q. Okay. I did it twice.
A. I didn't know she was 17.
Q. No, is she 17 or 18?
A. Maybe she was just lying to me saying 17, but she has a two-year-old --
Q. Yeah, that's her -- DETECTIVE EVANS: Yeah, that's her.
Q. -- she's got a little kid, so, okay, I owe two people an apology. DETECTIVE EVANS: That happens, you'll have that.
A. Yeah, she was at the laundry mat, I helped her carry her laundry before home,
Excerpt 115
A. She does nothing. DETECTIVEEVANS: I was going to say I figured she probably --
A. She does nothing at all, she wouldn't take nothing.
Q. What was the money in at her house?
A. This green thing. Did she ever call and report that missing?
Q. No.
A. She probably won't.
Q. No, she's a woman of God. DETECTIVE EVANS: Was that in the bedroom in a dresser or does she keep it in like a dresser drawer?
A. A stash. DETECTIVE EVANS: A stash, what's that?
Excerpt 116
Cited as: T St. Ex. 295, Grate Interview at the Ashland jail with Ashland Police Detective Kim Mager and Ashland Police Detective Brian Evans, 2:23 PM,
Q. Yeah.
A. I'd find a way if she needed anything, I'd get it for her.
Q. You got her some clothes, I think a pair of shoes she's wearing
A. Mm.
Q. -- even. Um, what room was the green thing in?
A. Living room.
Q. The living room, what was it on?
A. I think on her stand --
Q. Okay.
A. -- just her money bag, she might have had more, but when I've seen her in
Excerpt 117
A. 9[PM], probably about, maybe 10 o'clock [PM] is when she got there.
Q. 10 o'clock at night, and she's the one that drove you home?
A. Mm.
Q. From Circle, ah, BP area, she got there at 10 o'clock [PM] and how long, how
Excerpt 118
A. Yeah.
Q. -- why did you put lipstick on her?
A. Because her lip was busted too.
Q. To cover up her lip --
A. Yeah.
Q. -- or because you thought that would look pretty on her?
A. Well, my main objective was to cover it, to get her, with all the bruises on her,
Excerpt 119
Q. How long were you in there [at Charles Mills Park campground]?
A. About a month --
Q. DETECTIVE EVANS: No kidding.
A. -- in them three.
Q. What if somebody would have shown up? DETECTIVE EVANS: That's why he had a wire tie.
Q. You would have ran, you would have jumped out the back?
A. Mm, yeah.
Q. Did you worry that somebody was going to come? DETECTIVE EVANS: Yeah, that would be hard to sleep.
Q. Did you see the Rangers and stuff going by?
A. Yeah, I waved to them all the time.
Q. They would wave to you?
A. I was friends with them, I'd sit and talk to them sometimes.
Q. Did they know that you weren't supposed to be there, no?
A. No, I would always ask them, how is your day going today? DETECTIVE EVANS: That's the way to do it.
A. How's yours?
Q. Did they see you in different ones though?
Excerpt 120
Cited as: St. Ex. 295, Grate Interview at the Ashland jail with Ashland Police Detective Kim Mager and Ashland Police Detective Brian Evans, 2:23 PM,
Q. Just nice people?
A. Mm, yeah, sing, she'd sing Gospel music around the fire.
Q. Wow.
A. Old Gospel. DETECTIVE EVANS: Some of those are some good singers that can do that.
Q. Do you know what lot that was or who they were?
A. They were right by the, the shower. I forget their names, I really didn't know
Excerpt 121
Cited as: St. Ex. 295, Grate Interview at the Ashland jail with Ashland Police Detective Kim Mager and Ashland Police Detective Brian Evans, 2:23 PM,
Q. Is that one by the bridge, by the 430 bridge --
A. 430.
Q. -- is there?
A. Oh, no, this was up the hill, the Village.
Excerpt 122
A. No, there ain't no need for all that.
Q. How do you want to do it?
A. Normally they're standing too.
Q. Let's get it, can we video you, Shawn?
A. Yeah, you might as well. DETECTIVE EVANS: I 'm just going to tell them, so, they don't come in and Tase both of us. DETECTIVE MAGER: Oh, yeah, we don't want to get tased. DETECTIVE EVANS: I don't mind you showing me to choke me up, I don't want to get tased.
Excerpt 123
Q. What?
A. I had to choke a man out before.
Q. Okay.
A. But he stayed.
Q. Do you want to use me or him?
A. Him.
Q. Him, okay. DETECTIVE EVANS: I don't want to get choked twice.
A. Normally though -- DETECTIVE MAGER: Okay. This is Detective Mager, we have Detective Evans in the room, Shawn Grate in the room, it's September 15, 2016, the time is 17:04. Shawn's going to demonstrate the way he used his strangulation in, in the cases that we have been discussing.
A. Well, Elizabeth, right, it was kind of shocking, right, I was just joking, we were
Excerpt 124
Q. Okay.
A. - - do you know what I mean, I didn't release --
Q. Okay.
A. -- I continued.
Q. Okay. Shawn, um, that was with Elizabeth, how about with - - Elizabeth is the
Excerpt 125
Q. And you know that's not true --
A. Yeah.
Q. -- because you're in there?
A. Yeah.
Q. And obviously they would have known you were in there, if they would have
Excerpt 126
Q. So, you wrote, you wrote the dates, did you write any narrative or?
A. No, I didn't, I just wrote the date –
Q. You just wrote the date down?
A. -- the first date would be Elizabeth, the oldest one would be Elizabeth and the
Excerpt 127
Q. Are there other dates on there or just those dates?
A. Just them two.
Q. Why did you write those?
A. So, I would know, I like to have reference.
Q. Reference to?
A. How long their bodies are in there, been in there and trying like to know, well,
Excerpt 128
Q. Yeah.
A. Because I would hang out with her every day.
Q. Okay. So, it was to kind of see when they were there to kind of compare it to
Excerpt 129
Q. Okay.
A. -- like building things up, do you know what I mean?
Q. When you say building things up, what do you mean, meaning in your head or
Excerpt 130
Q. So, you wanted to tell me about the [Daily Reader] journal.
A. Yeah, because the dates are important I believe, right?
Q. Yes, I think they are.
A. Oh, I knew there was something else. Um, now Stacey, right, after she, like
Excerpt 131
Cited as: St. Ex. 300, Grate Interview at the Ashland jail with Ashland Police Detective Kim Mager and Ashland Police Detective Brian Evans, September
A. Yes, something like --
Q. What is that?
A. Over by the rock?
Q. I don't know where, um, I only know it because I think [name withheld] told me that.
A. Her and I, we walked there.
Q. Yeah, she said you guys took a journey out there.
A. Yeah, we took a journey.
Q. Yeah.
A. That was a good one.
Q. Yeah, that's far, that's a long walk --
A. It is.
Q. I don't know how many miles that is to get out from here to there?
A. I walked it a lot, I had a lot of time, I probably did it about eight times.
Q. Wow.
Excerpt 132
Cited as: St. Ex. 300, Grate Interview at the Ashland jail with Ashland Police Detective Kim Mager and Ashland Police Detective Brian Evans, September
Q. An opportunist?
A. Yeah.
Q. Okay, yeah.
A. Definitely an opportunist. I think things through, I'm pretty dangerous, you know,
Excerpt 133
A. Um, that guy, he's the one that brought me in.
Q. He is, you recognized him all this way, yeah, that's Curt Dorsey.
A. People, I remember people very good.
Q. He's a good guy.
A. Yeah, he's the one that pulled the gun on me, freeze.
Q. Yeah.
A. I'm free, he got [name withheld], do you know what I mean, it went good.
Q. Yeah, absolutely.
A. It couldn't have went no better, I was thinking about keeping her one more
Excerpt 134
A. [Shawn Grate] They never were used.
Q. Tell me about those. I mean that, that's one of those things --
A. Premeditated.
Q. What do you mean, premeditated meaning what, meaning you finish that
Excerpt 135
A. I mean, no, Elizabeth was already in the closet.
Q. When you put the restraints on?
A. She was already in the closet with all the clothes and the closet was sealed -
Q. Okay.
A. I think.
Q. So, you put the restraints on just in case if somebody else would be in there,
Excerpt 136
A. I think (inaudible, static).
Q. But she wasn't, she wasn't, had you ever had sex with her before?
A. Never.
Q. Okay. So, you're saying that with her it wasn't sexual?
A. No.
Q. The restraints on there, is that, in your mind, sexual, help me?
A. It was for [name withheld], I had to take her upstairs she would, she battles, she wanted
Excerpt 137
A. (Inaudible) right after Elizabeth.
Q. So, right after you --
A. I didn’t say nothing to [name withheld].
Q. -- (inaudible) so, right after Elizabeth you put the restraints on the bed for
Excerpt 138
A. Yeah, it would just be me.
Q. Is there any female that's going to be on there?
A. No, no, but it was meant to be --
Q. Okay.
A. -- just for [name withheld], I didn't know if we were going to be upstairs or downstairs,
Excerpt 139
A. Oh, yeah.
Q. Tell me about that.
A. That's just for [name withheld] just in case too.
Q. That was just in case for [name withheld], meaning you intended, you were going to keep
Excerpt 140
Q. Nothing physical happened there?
A. Hmm.
Q. Did you have any physical attraction to her at all?
A. No, just she, my attraction to her was, she was, she was, just wanted to -- it
Excerpt 141
A. That's what she says.
Q. At what point do you think I'm going to help her with that?
A. She calls me, it's about 11:30 at night.
Q. You knew right then, I mean had you been thinking about it that I could --
A. No, it was a surprise, it was a surprise call, she was bored, she, somehow it got
Excerpt 142
Q. Yeah.
A. -- Elizabeth's really confusing in my mind --
Q. Okay.
A. -- because she has a heart, a big heart.
Q. She does, I met her ten times probably.
A. Yeah, I talk to her.
Q. Yeah.
A. Yeah, she has.
Excerpt 143
Q. Tell me about that, were you thinking about it or?
A. That they're crazy (inaudible).
Q. I mean at what point when she at what point did you know I'm going to do this,
Excerpt 144
Q. So, she was over at your house or you were over at hers before?
A. Well, I was at her house and then I had told her I'm going to go home and eat.
Q. Okay. And you're at her house --
A. And she's like, oh, what are you having, I'm like oh, I got some barbeque
Excerpt 145
Q. And says she can't sleep (inaudible)?
A. Yeah, can't sleep.
Q. And then she came over?
A. She wanted me to meet her down at the YMCA.
Q. Did you meet her or did she just show up?
A. I walked, I met her.
Q. At the YMCA and you walked her back, did you know then?
A. No, I didn't know.
Q. You knew when you were downstairs and then, meaning you
Excerpt 146
Cited as: St. Ex. 303, Grate Interview at the Ashland jail with Ashland Police Detective Kim Mager and Ashland Police Detective Brian Evans, September
A. I guess.
Q. Well, if I'm -- help me if I'm wrong because --
A. I'm not sure.
Q. Okay. That's a good answer sometimes.
A. Maybe you're right.
Excerpt 147
Cited as: St. Ex. 305, Grate Interview at the Ashland jail with Ashland Police Detective Kim Mager and Ashland Police Detective Brian Evans, September
A. [Shawn Grate] I've been in Elizabeth's.
Q. Since she died?
A. Mm.
Q. Okay. Where are her keys?
A. Her key.
Q. It's just one key on a ring, okay.
A. I'm going to have to draw it.
Excerpt 148
Q. Like take a shower or what?
A. I just, it's like a bird bath in a way, I just kind of like --
Q. Yeah.
A. -- freshened up and, ah, I also, got, when we played Yahtzee, I wrote my name
Excerpt 149
Q. By yourself?
A. Yeah, I mean like the scoreboard --
Q. Yeah.
A. -- I wrote my name on it, it was sitting on the table.
Q. That's after [Elizabeth] died?
A. Yeah.
Q. Okay.
A. So, I went in and got that.
Q. What did you write, Shawn or did you write Grate?
A. Shawn.
Q. You wrote Shawn on her Yahtzee board?
A. I already grabbed it, I grabbed it already and ripped it up, disposed of it, it's
Excerpt 150
A. The key, the key would be somewhere in here.
Q. So, after she, after she was dead --
A. One single key.
Q. It's one single key and you threw it?
A. I just tossed it right in here.
Q. So, you kept it, how many times did you go in her apartment after she died?
A. Once.
Q. One time was that, and that was not the same day you went to [name withheld]'s, on a
Excerpt 151
Q. What do you mean?
Q. Probably three weeks already went by.
A. When you went into Elizabeth's?
A. No, I mean like one week went by, I went over to Elizabeth's --
Q. So, she was dead for a week and then you went into her apartment and you
Excerpt 152
A. I just went in trying to just look around, just like --
Q. What else is in there that you got, is there any money or food or?
A. Ah, paper towels.
Q. You took some paper towels, anything else?
A. I just kind of looked around, no, I went ahead and grabbed the shampoo too.
Q. What kind was it?
A. She has tons of them.
Q. Tons of shampoos?
A. She' s a little grabby on that one, I think.
Q. Yeah.
A. A whole bunch --
Excerpt 153
Cited as: St. Ex. 305, Grate Interview at the Ashland jail with Ashland Police Detective Kim Mager and Ashland Police Detective Brian Evans, September
Q. Okay.
A. -- she made sure she had enough shampoo for her whole life.
Q. Yeah, so, you took a shampoo, how many shampoos did you take?
A. One shampoo and one conditioner.
Q. Okay. And took them back to your place and the paper towels?
A. Well, I took the paper towels to the gas station to start cleaning it up.
Q. Meaning the Eagle to get it prepared for you staying there?
A. Yeah. The key is probably like right in here [referring to the hand-drawn map].
Excerpt 154
A. [Shawn Grate] Okay.
Q. --that's beautiful down there, isn't it?
A. It is.
Q. It's amazing, good people down there.
A. I had a blast, I didn't really meet no one, but one family.
Q. You said there was an older lady --
A. -- Older lady, yeah.
Q. -- you said she was singing at the fire?
A. Would sing old hymns around the fire.
Q. Do you know where that was, because you were by the, it was by the restroom?
A. Yeah, it was right by the restroom.
Q. The trailers that you were in there, how many in the Park were you in?
A. Three.
Q. Three in the Park?
A. They 're all side-by-side-by-side.
Excerpt 155
A. No.
Q. Are you sure, I mean did you pick it up just to check it out?
A. My fingerprints are on it, yeah.
Q. All right. Tell me about that.
A. I just looked at it, like it looks like a phone I had, that's what I was wondering,
Excerpt 156
Q. That might be the one you threw?
A. No, the Obama phone --
Q. Yeah.
Excerpt 157
Q. Did you take any pictures or anything?
A. No.
Q. I think they're trying to see, maybe it was used or something, I don't know
Excerpt 158
A. I opened it and through the pictures.
Q. What was on it?
A. Just some of her friends, ah, one of her girlfriends.
Q. Oh, it says there was a text attempt at 7:04 p.m., did you try it just to see if it
Excerpt 159
Q. Why not just take [Elizabeth] out of the house totally?
A. I don't know, that was, she'd be --
Q. Or had you already thought you could torch the house?
A. Yeah, once that happened, once after that happened as I was thinking what to
Excerpt 160
Q. She said that?
A. Yeah.
Q. After you strangled her or when you were strangling her?
A. Mm, when it was too late.
Q. Meaning what?
A. Elizabeth was already way, it was like way too late.
Q. Way too late --
A. We were talking --
Q. -- in your mind like it's going to happen or way too late during it, I didn't say
Excerpt 161
Q. Meaning --
A. I wanted to give her a hug.
Q. Meaning, I'm paraphrasing, correct me when I'm wrong, okay? Meaning you
Excerpt 162
Q. And she said that she had asked him?
A. Yeah.
Q. And you told her didn't -- weren't you already saved?
A. Well, she said it three times, what do you mean, yeah, it was an emotional one,
Excerpt 163
Q. Elizabeth?
A. Yeah.
Q. Why do you say that?
A. I could see it in her eyes, she was, she was just there she was like very
Excerpt 164
A. Yeah.
Q. Because we talked --
A. I didn't want to do it at all, I wanted to find a reason not to.
Q. Because we talked about how, the last time, how you were downstairs thinking
Excerpt 165
A. Yeah, mm.
Q. So, then you put your hands on her neck?
A. I was scared --
Q. But is it about, is it about how she does or are you at that point saying don 't
Excerpt 166
Q. -- Elizabeth was gone, you went back over to her apartment?
A. Yeah, when I went over there, I did get her pills.
Q. How many?
A. Whatever was in the drawer, ah, I think two bottles were in the drawer.
Q. Like how many pills did you take?
A. Um, maybe 50.
Q. How many like different kinds?
A. Maybe five different kinds.
Q. So, it was whatever was left in the bottles?
A. Yeah.
Q. So, you just took them out of the bottles, put them in the drawer, were the
Excerpt 167
A. Yeah, I put the bottles back in the drawer --
Q. Okay.
A. -- because they got my fingerprints on them.
Q. Okay.
A. I didn't worry about finger prints or anything.
Q. Do you know what kind of pills those were?
A. No.
Q. All right. Is that the pills that you had in the bowl in the house?
A. Mm, some of them.
Excerpt 168
Q. What else am I missing, are you all right?
A. I'm all right, just thinking.
Q. What are you thinking?
A. If I took anything else out of that apartment.
Q. Okay.
A. Paper towels I already mentioned.
Q. Paper towels --
A. I mentioned the pills.
Q. -- I think you said shampoo --
A. Oh, yeah, shampoo and conditioner.
Q. -- and conditioner.
A. And razors.
Q. Oh, razors?
A. Yeah.
Q. What did you do with that paper from the Yahtzee, did you rip it up, did you
Excerpt 169
Q. Because you were afraid somebody would come in?
A. Yeah.
Q. Okay.
A. And the smell started, like the lawnmower man, you know, yeah, that's when
Excerpt 170
A. No, when she lied to me.
Q. About, when you called her, when you call her out on it?
A. Yeah.
Q. So, --
A. Like different guys and she just took defense already like, yeah, he’s just a
Excerpt 171
Q. Okay.
A. -- I don't use much electric.
Q. That way nobody would see you or that way?
A. Yeah, because that house right, that house right up there is like the homeless
Excerpt 172
Q. Will you be honest with me about something?
A. Yeah.
Q. When you first offered to help Stacey, was it already brewing for you then?
A. No.
Q. When you went back to your place and waited or wherever and waited 10
Excerpt 173
A. Just, just talking, it was mainly just a conversation.
Q. So, when you left and came back --
A. I never left.
Q. Oh, you never left, okay.
A. No, I offered to give her the umbrella though and she just offered that I could
Excerpt 174
Q. So, when you --
A. -- it started brewing then that, dang, another - -
Q. So, it ' s brewing then?
A. -- just another sneaky woman, I'm going to use her --
Q. Okay.
A. -- then I learned, you know, that she told on herself about getting, I call it a
Excerpt 175
Q. So, when you asked her to come in?
A. I wasn't too sure what I was going to do, I mean --
Q. But you knew it might happen?
A. Yeah, it might --
Q. Thank you for being honest.
A. -- I wasn't too sure, I wasn't too sure, that's where I was like, it was premeditate
Excerpt 176
Q. Do you feel in that situation that --
A. I'll get worse and worse.
Q. Okay. And, and that's only once she comes in, she's going to say something
Excerpt 177
A. Yeah.
Q. Is that right?
A. Unfortunately.
Q. Okay.
A. Yeah, you're right. We hit it off though at first for a while, um, just talking and
Excerpt 178
Q. Can I, let me ask you this.
A. -- we just kissed, right, and started making out and everything was fine, right.
Q. When you're kissing and making out?
A. Yeah, we just fooled around just a little bit, you know, and just, then she
Excerpt 179
Cited as: St. Ex. 335, Grate Interview at the Ashland jail with Ashland Police Detective Kim Mager, 2:15 PM, October 17, 2016, Tr. 26.
Q. Did your back up phone have a cell -- have a number to it?
A. No, that was given to me.
Q. So, there's no cell, there's no number?
A. I never got it turned on.
Q. What's the number, is there a 543 number that you have [number withheld]?
A. [number withheld].
Q. What's that number?
A. Trac phone, that's the phone I got when I got the job at Save-A-Lot, so, they